One Country Project's Hot Dish

Heidi Heitkamp [00:00:05]:
Welcome to the Hot Dish. I'm Heidi Heitkamp.

Joel Heitkamp [00:00:07]:
You know what, I'm Joel Heitkamp. It's our last episode of 2024. You know, later I'm going to be speaking with my pal Chris Gibbs, who we've had Chris on the show before. He's a farmer from Ohio who isn't too happy with what is going to stand for farmers when it comes to all of these new tariffs.

Heidi Heitkamp [00:00:24]:
You know, it's interesting, Joel, because I found out yesterday that farmers are way optimistic. Right? I mean, when you look at kind of the numbers, do they feel good about the next four years? And then you look at kind of where input prices have been and where commodity prices are and you wonder is it just politics that they're optimistic about or is there a real reason why they're optimistic?

Joel Heitkamp [00:00:50]:
Yeah, if I know anything about Chris, he'll have some, some opinions on that and some things that should be followed. I mean, here's a Republican that turned into a Democrat, which is just the opposite of what we're seeing happen in rural areas. Heidi, I know we, we have some listener emails as well.

Heidi Heitkamp [00:01:09]:
How about it, Joel?

Joel Heitkamp [00:01:11]:
You know, some folks in South Dakota wrote in with, "We are Democrats but our children have married into Republican led families and we feel we're losing them. Do you have any advice?" I'll let you go first, Heidi.

Heidi Heitkamp [00:01:24]:
Yeah, I bet you would. I should have read the question right away. Right away. I missed an opportunity here, Joel. I think the best bit of advice that I have is to focus on what's really good about your in laws and don't pick a fight during holidays and you know, be strong in your opinions but not judgmental towards somebody's spouse.

Joel Heitkamp [00:01:49]:
Well, and so the advice I always give is let's just not talk politics.

Heidi Heitkamp [00:01:53]:
Yeah, but I mean, you know, that's the if, if you're thinking about the farm economy, if you're thinking about kind of even, even, you know, who's going to make decisions for the school board. You're talking politics. You're talking about who's governing America. And so I'm not a big believer in taking all of that off the table. I am a big believer in having respectful discussions.

Joel Heitkamp [00:02:15]:
Yeah. But there's always that one family member, Thomasine, that'll inject politics in and get everybody riled up and everybody started and.

Heidi Heitkamp [00:02:26]:
You know, hot stirs.

Joel Heitkamp [00:02:28]:
Yeah, exactly. And so I get it. My advice to them as an individual that has two son in laws, one I knew was a Democrat, in fact, probably a bigger Democrat than what I am. But he comes from up in that Iron Range kind of big lakes area of northern Minnesota. My other one came from a Republican family, or at least his father's side was, and he just didn't involve himself in public policy. He didn't. And you can still see it to this day. You can see that.

Joel Heitkamp [00:03:03]:
I think he votes pretty much Democrat. He walks in the parades with us, all of that. But, you know, our sister Julie's husband, Heidi is another good example. I mean, Richie was a rock solid Republican. He used to just shake his head at us.

Heidi Heitkamp [00:03:17]:
Yeah. Well, I remember when I first was dating Darwin, I was running for office. I mean, I was running as a Democrat on the statewide ballot for state auditor. I was young, 28 years old, and went to see Darwin's grandmother for some kind of holiday event. And I walked in the door and she goes, well, there she is, the little Democrat.

Joel Heitkamp [00:03:42]:
See, I would. If somebody called me little, I would have embraced that right off the bat, the little Democrat.

Heidi Heitkamp [00:03:49]:
But the irony is, I think Darwin's family is almost more liberal than ours. And so, you know, it's a lot easier. Let's just admit it. It's a lot easier if you're all on the same team. It's kind of like what it's like when you're sitting in the garage as a Packers fan and watching the Vikings literally take on the Falcons. Not a good look, anyway. And then your brother, your really mean brother starts going, oh, how did the packers do last week? How did they do on Thursday? You know, it's kind of like that, only maybe more serious.

Joel Heitkamp [00:04:23]:
That's so beneath your brother Dennis. I cheered him out for that. But it's a great question to ask because when they say that they feel like they're losing them, I can understand that. Because what's happened to me in the Trump era, Heidi, is I've actually lost friends over it. I really have. People that I'd pull into the VFW hall and have a beer with, and now I avoid because it just feels like you're constantly going to lose. What was great about that friendship? If you sit down and you hope that the era ends so that you're not constantly going back to a debate or to an argument about it. So they might not be children, they might not be that close, but I can feel their pain.

Heidi Heitkamp [00:05:13]:
And quite honestly, I mean, we've worked pretty hard at being good losers, acknowledging that we lost.

Joel Heitkamp [00:05:19]:
We have to be.

Heidi Heitkamp [00:05:20]:
Yeah, but. But, you know, people who. Who want to rub it in your Face. You know, I had a very close family relative that when I lost the race for the Senate, sent me an email saying, you're fired. I mean, you know, I'm like I said, I sent him back an email before I blocked him in or text message and said, what joy do you get out of that? I mean, you know, it's pretty obvious. I get it. But what joy do you get? Yeah, I think that the, the old golden rule is exactly the one that you should always pursue, which is treat people the way you would want to be treated. But I, I do have to say there are people who, Joel, you get the letters.

Heidi Heitkamp [00:06:03]:
I occasionally get the letters. You know, a lot of people who just can't just be good winners. I mean, they've got to like, be mean.

Joel Heitkamp [00:06:12]:
Yeah.

Heidi Heitkamp [00:06:12]:
And so that's always hard.

Joel Heitkamp [00:06:14]:
That's not the majority. But you're right. I mean, you're right. And if I remember right about that relative your baby brother dealt himself a hand to and gave him both barrels. And it, it wasn't your fault or my fault that God made him short. But he's still upset. I, you know, Heid, I want to, I want to ask you a little bit because, you know, the whole great thing about what we do here in Ottish is talk about the rural area. You know, we do what, what people in national media don't often do.

Joel Heitkamp [00:06:46]:
And so there's no farm bill yet. Donald Trump has always been quite honest when he talks about what he's going to do at the job. He really has. My disagreement has been what he says he's going to do because he does it when you look at the word tariff and tariff and tariff. I'm going to talk to Chris Gibbs about this a little bit later. I'm going to ask him about it. I mean, Heidi, farmers, maybe it's because we're old and we remember that the 70s and the, in the 80s and what that did to the farm economy, but they don't seem afraid of the word tariff at all. Heidi.

Heidi Heitkamp [00:07:24]:
Well, that's because the last time they got big checks and, you know, markets kind of came back when it was all over. It didn't change anything other than it encouraged Brazil to burn down more rainforest and plant more soybeans. And anytime you lose a market or become an unreliable market partner, there's damage going to be done to your brand and damage done to your opportunities. And, you know, we can talk about whether there's going to be compensation, but my concern more is long term and that the thing is people Say, well, he's going to tariff steel or tariff this or tariff that. And my point would be, but there's always a retaliation for that. And so you gotta look at the double whammy plus. And people would say, well, now we can get a decent farm bill. Really, there's 20 members of Congress who will never vote for a farm bill.

Heidi Heitkamp [00:08:14]:
Guess what, they're all Republican. And so this farm bill is going to have to be a compromise. And they're having a hard time right now as we talk, basically coming up with an idea for an extension of the existing farm bill. But you don't get a farm bill unless it's bipartisan. And you know, I know Bozeman very well. He's going to be chairing the Ag Committee. Good guy. And he's going to understand that.

Heidi Heitkamp [00:08:39]:
But I think the challenge here won't be so much the Senate. I think it's going to be the House. And can we just mention Amy Klobuchar is going to be ranking member on agriculture and she's well known for her work working across the aisle.

Joel Heitkamp [00:08:52]:
So what I'm trying to build to and what I'm going to talk to Chris a little bit about is the infrastructure that goes along long term with these tariffs. I mean, if you're China, you're looking at who can raise soybeans. And then you start looking at Brazil, and then you start thinking about Brazil and saying, well, if we can't buy from America without these being the rules, let's buy from Brazil and see if they're going to be a little kinder to us. Well, the next thing you know, you're building ports in Brazil. Well, that's a long term investment. I mean, you start putting up ports where you're going to do trade in Brazil. You're not just going to shut those down for years at length. And yet the farmers that I talk to don't see that as a threat.

Heidi Heitkamp [00:09:40]:
The other thing that farmers are saying is he won't do it. It's just a negotiating ploy. And you know, I learned from a very experienced trial lawyer once when I was lawyering and I said, well, let's tell them we're sue em. He goes, are you ready to sue him? I said, not today. I, you know, I'm just, I just want them to know we'll sue him. They go, never say you'll sue them unless you're willing to sue them unless you got the complaint drafted. And I think the same thing is true. I mean, you can't threaten tariffs and then back away.

Heidi Heitkamp [00:10:12]:
And I, you know, based on his interview with Meet the Press, he has no intention of backing off tariffs.

Joel Heitkamp [00:10:24]:
Well, obviously, I've been waiting for this. Ladies and gentlemen, Chris Gibbs is somebody that I love talking to. I get a chance to talk to often and visit with. And you know what? Mr. Gibbs is somebody who, well, quite frankly, made the right choice in life as far as I'm concerned. But Chris Gibbs, farmer, former Republican, now Democrat, joins us. Chris, how the hell are you?

Chris Gibbs [00:10:49]:
I'm really good here in west central Ohio. Kind of, kind of mushy out there today, but I'm glad to have the crops off, the cows are taken care of and we're right here talking to you. Couldn't have it any better.

Joel Heitkamp [00:11:00]:
I really appreciate it. It's always fun getting a chance to visit with you here on the Hot dish. Chris, when you think about this last election, what first comes to your mind?

Chris Gibbs [00:11:10]:
You know, you have to divide this amongst what's happening on national stage versus what I'm seeing here locally. You know, locally we had, it was tough. It was tough here in, in Shelby County, Ruby red, Western Ohio, 80% vote for Trump, 20% vote ish for Vice President Harris. Pretty tough slide nationally, pretty much the same way. At the end of the day, the party appears like it's, it didn't communicate, it didn't resonate with the working class voter. I'm going to tell you something. I think it's much, much deeper than that. The talking heads, I guess all at the national level are going for this working class voter.

Chris Gibbs [00:11:58]:
We got to do better at that and so forth. I think it's a lot deeper out here in western Ohio in these Ruby Red counties. The brand, the Democratic brand has been so damaged that people don't only distrust Democrats, they loathe Democrats. It's just many times pure hate. So we've got that to overcome and we've got a long way to go.

Joel Heitkamp [00:12:25]:
Well, and I think you're right. I mean, I live that very same life in the, in the rural area that I'm at. And it seems as though to me, Chris, that oftentimes the rural Democratic message is getting confused with the urban Democratic message. And I'm curious what your thoughts are on that.

Chris Gibbs [00:12:44]:
Well, you're right on that. And you know, we often talk in this space, those of us trying to bridge that urban, rural divide, that there's some kind of a great difference. I'm not sure there's really a difference in what people are interested in. Everybody's interested in good health care. Everybody's interested in low crime, everybody's interested in clean water. But somewhere along the line, particularly in these Republican rural red counties, listen, these are values voters here. These are values voters and these folks were vote for their values. Whether it's gun control, whether it's abortion, whether it's same sex marriage, whether it's religion, you click it off, whatever, that's how they're going to vote.

Chris Gibbs [00:13:32]:
And I don't care what policy a Democrat candidate brings or national party brings to rural counties. I don't care if you're going to bring them a new fire station. I don't care if you're going to bring them child tax credits. I don't care if you're going to cut ribbons on this or that. Chips act, whatever. They'll take your trinkets, they'll take that stuff and they may even say thank you, but they still won't vote for you. And why is that? Because these are values voters at the core and they believe, right or wrong, that over the last two decades the Democrats have come after their values. They believe that the barbarians are at the door and that's how we got Trump, is that they said, well, we're going to deflect that.

Chris Gibbs [00:14:21]:
We're going to have to hire our own barbarian to protect our own.

Joel Heitkamp [00:14:26]:
Sherrod Brown, to me is an indicator that what you said is spot on, that you nailed it. But I have to ask you this, and I've been dying to get a chance to do it, how much of this has to do with the fact that Democrats have won on so many issues that matter? And I'm going to give you an example, Chris. In my old legislative district, when I was winning elections there, one of the things that I was working on was health insurance. I was working on paid workers leave. I was working on, you know, issues involving workers, cop injured workers. And we won on those things. We got all those things. And now there isn't such a need for somebody to work on those things as much as there is in their mind to protect their guns and to fight gays.

Joel Heitkamp [00:15:18]:
I mean, I'm curious what you think about that.

Chris Gibbs [00:15:21]:
Yeah, let's go back to Sherrod Brown. Sherrod Brown. I mean, what more in Ohio, what more better example do you need than a working class, working class politician? He's just solid, frumpy, ruffled hair, get down, do the work politician, but still couldn't win. And again, I go back to these values. Sherrod Brown was swept along from the national, from the national stage, from the national current that had framed Democrats as far left outside of the mainstream of what was important to rural Americans, to Ohio voters as well.

Joel Heitkamp [00:16:08]:
You lost Sherrod Brown, which means the nation lost Sherrod Brown in large part. When you lose to Sherrod Brown, you gotta wonder if it's because you already won the battles and it isn't something else like you've made reference to.

Chris Gibbs [00:16:21]:
You know, I think there's a lot of battles left to do. I think healthcare needs help. We need to maintain the Affordable Care Act. That's gonna be under threat under Trump and his administration. Let's talk about the CHIPS Act. The CHIPS act is gonna be under threat. We never got billed back better because partly because of Joe Manchin and cinema. So there's plenty left to do.

Chris Gibbs [00:16:48]:
Certainly, we've made strides, but there's as Democrats. But there's certainly plenty left to do. But Democrats aren't able to make that case because voters don't trust them on the values level. They just don't trust them. They don't trust the brand. They don't trust the brand. So it's all about rebuilding the brand and demonstrating shared values.

Joel Heitkamp [00:17:12]:
But in the end, Chris, while I don't disagree with you, in fact, I agree with you immensely. In the end, what role do you think eggs played in all of this?

Chris Gibbs [00:17:23]:
Well, if we're using eggs as a metaphor, of course, for the price of groceries and generally in general, for the price of everything. And I fought hard about this because Democrats are really good, even the White House was really good about talking about the stock market in 401ks and all of that kind of stuff. I'll tell you what, I'll tell you why that doesn't resonate. Number one, a 401k in the stock market, no matter if you're getting your 401k from the employer, whether you're a federal employee, whatever, where you're at, whatever you're getting that you can't liquidate that. You can't turn that into purchasing power at the grocery store or at the car lot or at the mechanic store or whatever. You can't do that. So at the end of the day, people are not going to worry about saving their democracy from Trump and his administration, saving our republic, if their belly and their wallet doesn't meet their expectations, doesn't meet what they expect for themselves and their household and their family. And that's where the Democrats lost it, is that we didn't tell them why it was important at the kitchen.

Chris Gibbs [00:18:35]:
table we told them globally why it was important at a 35,000 foot level that the economy is doing this and doing that. But I'll tell you what, unless you're taking dividends, which very few of us do, unless you're taking dividends out of your 401k, which you don't do, unless you're taking dividends from the stock market, which is rare for middle class folk, then a high price for a hamburger at McDonald's hits you hard in your daily paycheck.

Joel Heitkamp [00:19:01]:
But Chris, when did farmers quit caring about tariffs?

Chris Gibbs [00:19:06]:
They believe. Farmers believe and God love them, they believe that the tariffs won't happen and if they do happen and hurt them, that they'll be compensated because that's exactly what happened last time. They were compensated from Trump, from the taxpayer, from the treasury, from the Commodity Credit Corporation. They were compensated. They don't believe that's going to hurt. And this is exactly what I said in the beginning. You can bring policy or you can bring policy, you can alert policy that we don't want to have, like tariffs and so forth, but they still won't vote for you because they don't believe at the end of the day, Democrats share their core values and that is much bigger than this is why those of us in this space pull our hair out. Farmers and rural Americans appear to vote against their own economic interest and it drives people nuts.

Chris Gibbs [00:19:58]:
And you say, well, why do they do that? Why do they do that? They say, farmers think, well, I can handle my own economic interests, but what I'm not going to vote for is somebody that doesn't believe what I believe at a core level.

Joel Heitkamp [00:20:10]:
Okay, so you pull up to Senex and you pull in there and you grab a cup of coffee and you're sitting down with the boys, you know, and I'm the one that brought up tariffs. But you know, things like tariffs cause places like China to go to Brazil and start building ports so that they can control shipping, actually own the ports. Does that ever come up at that? Cynics. Is that something that people ever talk about and say, look, long term, long range, this is dangerous, it's talked about.

Chris Gibbs [00:20:44]:
But they disregard it. And many of us in this space, you can accuse me of this. I've warned farmers to the extent that they believe I'm being derogatory. But you know what? Mom told me and she hollered at me, don't put your hand on a hot stove. And she didn't tell me that because she didn't like me. She did that because she loved me and cared about me. She didn't want me to get hurt. I tell farmers that, listen, there's a ton of perils coming at you potentially, whether it's tariffs.

Chris Gibbs [00:21:17]:
And by the way, you're exactly right, Joel. We proved that we lost the soybean market. It went to Bolsonaro in Brazil and President Z started buying soybeans there and that has happened. So I'll tell you what I'm worried about. I'm worried about RFK Jr. This is one of the under told stories and this is what I warn farmers about, is RFK Jr. Is coming for your way of life, for your way to produce crops in this country. He's after glyphate, he's after chemicals and pesticides that we have used since the 40s, 2, 4D dicamba, et cetera, et cetera, to increase our production to ensure that.

Chris Gibbs [00:22:04]:
You talked about it, Joel. The price of eggs continues to be low and Trump's RFK Jr. I swear to God is going to come after these things. He's going to come after crop insurance, he's going to try to implement what's happening in Project 2025 in the AG space. There are tons of perils coming at farmers and I warn them on a daily basis of this, just like my mom warned me, don't put your hand on a hot stove. But I'll tell you what, they may have to hear the sizzle.

Joel Heitkamp [00:22:35]:
So Chris, let me put you in this spot because clearly you recognize the problem and it's going to end up coming down to the solution in rural America, quite frankly, in America, period. I'm going to appoint you to a job you don't want when you're out there feeding cattle. I'm going to appoint you chairman of the Democratic Party. If you were chair of the Democratic Party, what would you do?

Chris Gibbs [00:23:00]:
What I would do is to, number one, make the Democratic Party complete throughout the whole United States to support state parties. And we've got a new DNC chairman coming up here and a number of these candidates for the Democratic National Committee chairperson has talked about this. Number of the candidates have is that every state has to be supported. And I don't mean just every state, I mean every county has to be supported. We need to build, rebuild these county parties in every of the 3,200 odd counties across the whole United States. We need to have a presence. We did this in Shelby county over the last 14 months since I've been chair. 15 months is that we're ready now to put people on school boards.

Chris Gibbs [00:23:47]:
We need it. We need a farm team. You got to have a farm team. It's school boards, it's township trustees, it's all of that. You have to build that up from the bottom, from the one end, and the other end is just as important. We need messengers at the top of this party that have demonstrated values that are credible across the whole of the United States. And I'm going to say this. We'll get pushback.

Chris Gibbs [00:24:13]:
I'll get pushback. Not just we need these people, not from the east coast or the west coast. They need to be in the middle. They need to be in the moderate middle. They need to be in ruby red America, in rural America. And they have to have demonstrated values. They have to be people that are feeding cows. That's a metaphor.

Chris Gibbs [00:24:33]:
Not everybody has to feed cows. But they have to be people that have experienced what the voters were going after, the working class voters have experienced. They can't be somebody that has never experienced it. They have to have credibility. That's where I'd start. Both ends. Credibility at the top with a messenger. Because the policies that the Democratic Party has are solid.

Chris Gibbs [00:24:59]:
Whether it's fair wages, whether it's clean water, whether you. Whether it's healthcare, whether it's child tax credits for childcare, all of those are great policies. But you got to have a messenger that has the credibility of the flyover states.

Joel Heitkamp [00:25:15]:
Chris, like you, man, I love where I live. It might be in Ruby red. Got found out when you lost Sherrod Brown, that you're more red than I had hoped Ohio would be. But I like where I live, just like you. And thank you, by the way, for coming on the Hot dish. Always being available to have these discussions, man.

Chris Gibbs [00:25:34]:
You're more than welcome.

Joel Heitkamp [00:25:35]:
You know what? Merry Christmas to you, buddy.

Chris Gibbs [00:25:38]:
Merry Christmas. Take care.

Joel Heitkamp [00:25:46]:
And so, Heidi, how foolish was it for Joe Biden to give a pardon to his son Hunter?

Heidi Heitkamp [00:25:52]:
I did a number of interviews and they asked me. I just never thought it would happen. And I said, he will tarnish his legacy. But you gotta remember, George Bush pardoned his son. And you know, we don't remember that George Bush did that until afterwards, but to me, okay, so let's admit this. I used to be a tax collector. I think what he did, evading taxes was wrong. I think he should have been punished for it.

Heidi Heitkamp [00:26:15]:
It's not like that was a political prosecution. I think the gun thing in Rhode island was pretty lame. But not the prosecution of tax evasion.

Joel Heitkamp [00:26:26]:
You did say a number of episodes back that America loves its ex presidents, and you're right about that. You look at George W. Bush, he didn't exactly go out on a high. Bill Clinton, I mean, we got the controversy that came there, and yet these men are loved now, you know, I don't know if we're in a different time with this president, but what I will tell you is I don't think it tarnishes his legacy as much as what it gives the other side something to argue about when they do what they were going to do anyway, which is pardon a bunch of the January 6th insurrectionists, which is pardon themselves.

Heidi Heitkamp [00:27:04]:
We're going to be talking about a lot of this stuff six months from now when some of his political appointments are stalled. I don't think that saying right off the bat that you're going to not require FBI background checks for people who are going to sit in the highest seats in the land is necessarily a good look. But, Joel, I've quit predicting what's going to outrage the public.

Joel Heitkamp [00:27:33]:
I think that's fair. Let me ask you something about your old colleagues.

Heidi Heitkamp [00:27:37]:
Yeah.

Joel Heitkamp [00:27:38]:
Well, they get these judges appointed. Will the Democrats get their work done?

Heidi Heitkamp [00:27:43]:
I think they already cut a deal and they know which direction they're going to go. And the answer is. Yeah, the one. Not everyone, but they'll finish up strong in terms of judicial appointments.

Joel Heitkamp [00:27:54]:
I just want to put this out there because, you know, I think I'm helping you more than I'm hurting you by doing this. Are you ready? Okay. So turkey, ham, prime rib, in Sue's case, meatballs, crown roast. All of those things can be considered goose. You know, those could be. Yeah, he's right. But all of those things could be traditional Christmas food. Agreed.

Joel Heitkamp [00:28:25]:
Not enchiladas. All I'm saying is not enchiladas. And for those of you that don't.

Heidi Heitkamp [00:28:34]:
Know myself right away, insensitive. Insensitive to other people's palates and cuisines. Insensitive.

Joel Heitkamp [00:28:40]:
I'm talking about the upper Midwest. And for those of you that don't know, that is my sister Heidi's go to. The rest of the family loves them. They really do. But to me, that's frosted flake steak. That's all I'm telling you.

Heidi Heitkamp [00:28:54]:
Well, we'll talk to you after Christmas, Joel. And when my family, you know, my family is happy because they've had a much broader palate food delivery to a broader palate, you know. No, seriously, like, do you think sue will make me extra meatballs and send them to my house?

Joel Heitkamp [00:29:14]:
Oh, you know, she would.

Heidi Heitkamp [00:29:15]:
I know.

Joel Heitkamp [00:29:16]:
She's so good with the hamburger that I buy at Fairmont Lockers, which was by beef raised locally, which is by, I have no doubt to our great South Dakota text messenger that sent in raised by a Republican rancher. So don't worry about it if he's your son in law because they still raise good beef.

Heidi Heitkamp [00:29:38]:
There you go. Well, listen, wishing everyone absolutely the merriest of Christmas, Very happy holiday, very wonderful new year. We're going to be back here at the Hot Dish in the beginning of the new year talking about what the new administration's going to do for rural America, what rural America is talking about, and maybe even talking to Joel about whether he's starting to figure out if he can get prevent plant on his pumpkin patch.

Joel Heitkamp [00:30:09]:
Hey, I yielded pretty doggone. Well, you saw some of the pictures. You know, remember, you can send your email to podcast@onecountryproject.org that's podcast@onecountryproject.org. You know, here's the thing, I too want to wish everybody a Merry Christmas and a happy New Year. Obviously, this is our last one of the year. And all joking aside, Merry Christmas to you too.

Heidi Heitkamp [00:30:34]:
Yeah, take care, Joel. And we'll see you in the new year.

Joel Heitkamp [00:30:38]:
You bet. We'll be back on January 8th, and that's in three weeks with more Hot dish comfort food for middle America. Have a great holiday season and a great new year.